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Remembrance Gorbatchev, dies at 92
- Thread starter Ivan le Fou
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I really recommend watching that documentary by Werner Herzog.
One of the most striking quote from that documentary being when he talked about his wife.
-Do you remember her voice? Her laughter?
-Yes, absolutely.
-Her smell, the perfume?
-All of it. More than you can imagine.
-How much do you miss her?
-When she died, my life was taken away from me.
But also his answer to Werner's question on what should be put on his gravestone: We tried.
One of the most striking quote from that documentary being when he talked about his wife.
-Do you remember her voice? Her laughter?
-Yes, absolutely.
-Her smell, the perfume?
-All of it. More than you can imagine.
-How much do you miss her?
-When she died, my life was taken away from me.
But also his answer to Werner's question on what should be put on his gravestone: We tried.
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He will be remembered with fondness and a true statesman - pity about what came afterwards
State funeral will be three Lada's - or a stretch Lada
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Watched it about a year or so ago. It was hard to not shed a tear for that part. RIP Mr. Gorbachev.
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On the plus side, Gorbachev brought about:
Freedom of speech/expression(considerable improvements if not total)
Freedom to conduct business
Freedom of individuals to emigrate and republics to secede
While an argument can be made that Gorbachev was the guy unfortunate enough to preside over the reorganisation of Russia and deconstruction of the Soviet Communist Empire, another argument could be made that Gorbachev is the convenient scapegoat for the complete emasculation and total humiliation of Russia.
There are few more humiliating visuals for the right leaning “Russia strong!” crowd than that of Gorbachev in a Pizza Hut commercial:
Followed by Pizza Hut’s logo on the side of a Russian proton rocket.
It signals humiliating defeat.
It also plays a role in our current situation today and Putin’s effort to build a Potemkin Empire to restore Russian power.
Gorbachev negotiated poorly(albeit from a position of weakness) and his move towards freedom led to horrific unintended consequences that both directly laid the foundation and funded the Russian oligarchy and mafia state today(plundering $250B back when a billion was actually a lot of money), saw Russian life expectancy and standard of living collapse for a generation, and saw Chinese Communist Party totalitarian leadership crush dissent and democratic reform as a direct result of what Gorbachev did in Russia, focusing on just economic reform under an iron fist.
China’s plan, after watching Russia closely for the last 35 years, could be simply described as “Do the exact opposite of Gorbachev”.
The commentary from the US western Right about Presidents Clinton/Obama/Biden deconstructing the USA and it’s economic/geopolitical/military power possesses some correlation with what happened in Russia during and after Gorbachev.
I think of Gorbachev along the lines of President Jimmy Carter.
Both people I would have wanted to meet and talk to. People with integrity trying to do the right thing.
Good people. But both damned for eternity for being dangerously and strategically weak.
The kind of weakness found in a Neville Chamberlain, but with unintended consequences that play out over 1-5 decades rather than 1-5 years.
The US benefitted massively in the short-to-medium term from Gorbachev.
The jury is still out on the long-term.
Freedom of speech/expression(considerable improvements if not total)
Freedom to conduct business
Freedom of individuals to emigrate and republics to secede
While an argument can be made that Gorbachev was the guy unfortunate enough to preside over the reorganisation of Russia and deconstruction of the Soviet Communist Empire, another argument could be made that Gorbachev is the convenient scapegoat for the complete emasculation and total humiliation of Russia.
There are few more humiliating visuals for the right leaning “Russia strong!” crowd than that of Gorbachev in a Pizza Hut commercial:
Followed by Pizza Hut’s logo on the side of a Russian proton rocket.
It signals humiliating defeat.
It also plays a role in our current situation today and Putin’s effort to build a Potemkin Empire to restore Russian power.
Gorbachev negotiated poorly(albeit from a position of weakness) and his move towards freedom led to horrific unintended consequences that both directly laid the foundation and funded the Russian oligarchy and mafia state today(plundering $250B back when a billion was actually a lot of money), saw Russian life expectancy and standard of living collapse for a generation, and saw Chinese Communist Party totalitarian leadership crush dissent and democratic reform as a direct result of what Gorbachev did in Russia, focusing on just economic reform under an iron fist.
China’s plan, after watching Russia closely for the last 35 years, could be simply described as “Do the exact opposite of Gorbachev”.
The commentary from the US western Right about Presidents Clinton/Obama/Biden deconstructing the USA and it’s economic/geopolitical/military power possesses some correlation with what happened in Russia during and after Gorbachev.
I think of Gorbachev along the lines of President Jimmy Carter.
Both people I would have wanted to meet and talk to. People with integrity trying to do the right thing.
Good people. But both damned for eternity for being dangerously and strategically weak.
The kind of weakness found in a Neville Chamberlain, but with unintended consequences that play out over 1-5 decades rather than 1-5 years.
The US benefitted massively in the short-to-medium term from Gorbachev.
The jury is still out on the long-term.
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